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Native PAS PEDELEC support

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shaman
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Native PAS PEDELEC support

Any chance of adding PAS/PEDELEC capabilities to the VESC Tool/firmware? Maybe could be an option in the setup wizard to do this? Could be useful for the ebikers.

benjamin
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This has been in the software todo list for a while, but I haven't implemented it yet. The reason is that this usually is a legal requirement, and another legal requirement (in Sweden at least) is that the motor has a power below 250 W, which makes most VESC hardware kind of overkill.

Out of curiosity, are there places where a PAS sensor is required, but the allowed power is higher? Also, is it desirable for e.g. convenience to have a PAS sensor instead of a throttle? I can put it on higher priority if there are more good reasons to use a PAS sensor.

shaman
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It depends on the country or even state at to whether or not power(watts) is the limiting factor. Some places make speed the limiting factor rather than power. The laws are especially different outside the UK or EU. There is a decent summary of laws in various countries and states in the article below.

https://wheelsgo.net/government-standards-for-electric-bicycles-in-vario...

Being able to adjust power/speed profiles along with pedal assist can be good for travelers taking their ebike from State to State or from Country to Country where laws can change. 

storklompen
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For Sweden and all other EU countries Electric bikes should be constructed according to EN15194, which for the Motor means "the maximum continuous rated power shall be measured according to EN 60034-1 when the motor reaches its thermal equilibrium as specified by the manufacturer."

EN15194 though doesn't use the word controller specifically, and mostly doesn't seem to know that it exist, more then as part of the motor.

There are 2 thing to consider though:

1 You are still allowed to build your own E-bike without CE-marking, as long as it is safe in traffic, has a safe electrical installation, use PAS for powering the motor, and the motor or electronics has a continuous effect of 250W, and you are not planning on selling it.

2 Most european countries have some extra regulations which equals small motor driven devices to pedestrians as long as they have the speed of a pedestrian (<5km/h)

 

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Cargo bikes, the bigger, the better.

storklompen
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With that said.

I'm planning on making/remaking/adding to the VESC all the components to make my cargobikes as lawfull as possible.

For the moment being:

  1. PAS sensor (cheap cots)
  2. Speed sensor (cheap cots, magnet in wheel)
  3. Display with info (cheap cots, maybe the bafang which is reprogrammable)
  4. Possibility to set power level like other e-bikes have. (3 step, cots)
  5. Brake sensors (power switch off)
  6. thumb throttle only working when PAS active
  7. Software which will use upp 1000 Watt up to 8km/h and 250 Watt when over 20 km/h. (this will make it work according to legal when tested in a roller bank. I'll call it the VAG patch.)
  8. Probably an extra 1000 Watt motor for upp to 5km/h when the primary maxes out in slopes...

 

 

 

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Cargo bikes, the bigger, the better.

Schagg
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For someone wich is just able to use his feets (loosen the arms)......?

derlucas (github bldc app-ev.h ) forked the vesc-tool not bad. the problem is the non-sence of pedal-direction...wich could be very dangerous.

if a hall sensor is used, the duty-cycle gives info about direction.

sadly im not able to figure out how to do...

 

calibratable should be:

min cycles (magnets passing) before start ( safety)

duty < or > 50% (if magnet disk mounted other direction)

stop after x sec no cycle (safety)

pas together with throttle (throttle till x km\h then only max if pas active),\

pas independent (cadence x transmissionfactor x correcture potentiometer)

speed (wheel diameter x signals)

 

pin layout:

the ppm for hall-pas-sensor (15kohm between + and signal as pullup)

the adc1 as throttle (duty cycle or current)

tx speed (if gnd = one pulse)

rx limit erpm to x (while gnd active) (for gearshift)

break leavers could just drop down the adc1

adc2 pushaid?
 

hope to find somone who can help me.

ps: in swiss till 25kmh/500w ......... for s-pedelec 45kmh/1000w

 

Thank you and have a nice time

th0masrtg
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Hi, I am as well looking for a PAS / Torque sensor support for my ebike which uses a thumb throttle on the vesc at the minute. 

In termes of law, it is said that the power limit is 250w but it is rarely respected by the manufacturer (bosh /shimano), the bike is electronically blocked to never exceed the 25km/h but still get torque, then it must be geared by PAS sensor.

I would love to use a such sensor on my 1000w ebike.